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Kilmacud's Paul Mannion with Glen's Conor Glass and Ryan Dougan. Laszlo Geczo/INPHO

All-Ireland club final mess grows as Glen-Kilmacud saga looks set to rumble on

Both sets of players and their clubs have found themselves in a sticky spot.

LAST UPDATE | 25 Jan 2023

IT APPEARED TO be a week in the GAA calendar which marked a changing of the guard.

The club season reaching a close last Sunday with the senior showpieces in Croke Park and the focus shifting to the big throw-in for the inter-county game, the serious business of the Allianz Leagues commencing this weekend.

It would be natural for the outcomes of the club finals to linger for a while in the GAA conversation. The themes of recovery from Ballyhale Shamrocks and Kilmacud Crokes, in winning less than a year after suffering crushing disappointment in the corresponding 2022 fixtures, was certainly noteworthy.

But while the enduring brilliance of Ballyhale is acknowledged, the football fallout has overshadowed Sunday’s fare and deflected the spotlight away from the inter-county fixtures programme.

With the final whistle of the senior football decider, Rory Gallagher, Dessie Farrell and indeed Pádraic Joyce would have been entitled to start thinking of a timeline for bringing those club stars back into the county fold. Rest would be needed after the exertions of chasing the Andy Merrigan Cup, yet this is a week generally to sound players out on their possible return to inter-county panels.

When exactly Conor Glass, Paul Mannion and Shane Walsh and others will officially have their club duties wrapped up is now up for debate.

Kilmacud Crokes won Sunday’s game by 1-11 to 1-9 but uncertainty has only intensified since with doubt cast on the outcome by the extra players they had on the pitch for that brief spell in injury time. The news that filtered through last night of Glen’s official objection to the result simply hardens the position. When a resolution will appear is unclear. This is a saga that looks set to rumble on.

The GAA’s CCCC are believed to be meeting today to review the matter in the wake of Glen’s objection. If they find the rule has been broken, there are three possible penalties – a fine, a replay or the forfeiture of the game.

The first may seem too lenient and the third too severe. Does that leave the second as the choice that will sit best with parties? That’s not guaranteed. It has been suggested that it is not clearcut Kilmacud Crokes would agree to a replay if ordered to do so. There is likely a sense of grievance amongst them that a hard-earned All-Ireland title has been diminished to an extent by this controversy and the confusion over whether the success will stand.

There is also the matter of when would a replay take place? Given Crokes have three days to lodge a counter objection to any decision, a second instalment of the rivalry will not take place this weekend and the appeals process could well rule out next weekend, 4-5 February, as well.

The next game pencilled in for Croke Park is a Dublin league double-header on Saturday 25 February. Would provincial venues come into play for a replay and how would that fit in with the stadium requirements for counties for league games already planned?

And can, or will, all the playing stakeholders stick around if the process is prolonged before a final decision is reached? It is likely that personal plans in the lives of the players have been put on hold while committing to what was necessary to pursue this All-Ireland club dream. Hurling champions Ballyhale Shamrocks have been open on how travel plans will now be the priority for a chunk of their squad. In a world that has now opened up again in the wake of Covid-19, it may well be a factor here as well.

Both sets of players, and those officials connected with their setups, have found themselves in a sticky spot.

For Kilmacud the sheer joy was clear at landing the Andy Merrigan Cup, particularly in light of the painful manner in which it slipped out of their grasp the previous year. Their celebrations were understandable in the wake of winning the game but they must have been gradually tempered by the ongoing speculation over a possible appeal. Now that the official objection has been launched, how do they get into the right headspace to get themselves right if a replay is ordered?

It is a strange situation to embrace and amidst their own dejection at their defeat, the Glen players had to wrestle with a dilemma. The lack of a concrete plan of action from the GAA at national level was clearly an irritant. The GAA kicked the ball into their court in terms of decision-making. “This is extremely disappointing for our club to be placed in this position,” was the Glen verdict in Monday night’s statement.

The pressure placed on Glen to be the ones to kickstart the review process must have jarred with those in the club. There may be an element of discomfort at the prospect that some will see an appeal as them refusing to accept their defeat.

Malachy O’Rourke, admittedly speaking in a personal capacity and just moments after the final whistle when the full implications of the injury-time drama may not have been fully absorbed, was measured in his summary.

“We had our chances, we gave it our best shot. Look it, that shouldn’t happen. I can’t speak for the club but I just think we’ll accept we got beat on the day.”

But there is certainly a legitimacy to the frustration that Glen must feel. A basic rule of the game was not adhered to, no matter for how brief a passage of play. There is no guarantee they will get the chance to make amends in future All-Ireland finals. It is a long club road to travel through county and province before reaching the final two in the national arena. Former Derry player Damian Cassidy described it as ‘a once-in-a-lifetime’ opportunity on Newstalk, his views chiming with those who believe every chance to get a shot at winning an All-Ireland must be explored.

From whatever angle it is viewed, this is an almighty mess for Kilmacud Crokes, Glen and the GAA to deal with.

The only thing that looks certain is fallout to last Sunday’s final will drag on.

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    Mute John O Reilly
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    Jan 25th 2023, 3:47 PM

    The chance of them scoring a goal from a free in the last minute was minimal. A sub should only be allowed on when a player comes off like on soccer. Officials to blame

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    Mute Nite Cabs
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    Jan 25th 2023, 4:16 PM

    @John O Reilly: Tipp scored a goal in injury time against Offaly in the U20 All Ireland final last year. It came from a free in. It does happen

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    Mute John O Reilly
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    Jan 25th 2023, 4:40 PM

    @Nite Cabs: but it didn’t last Sunday and it wasn’t the extra man that stopped it

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    Mute Sean O'Toole
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    Jan 25th 2023, 5:13 PM

    @John O Reilly: Minimal but possible. Don’t forget that the Crokes’ goalie made a super save, which led to the 45, so another opportunity could arise. But I wonder what would’ve happened had the opposition then scored a goal, thus winning. Would Crokes’ lodge an appeal because they had the extra man, who knows? I agree, though, that the bottom line is that the officials were totally to blame. I was up for Crokes due to the Shane Walsh transfer, but a replay is only fair.

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    Mute Kevin Strathern
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    Jan 26th 2023, 12:05 PM

    @John O Reilly: I wonder if Glen had an extra man on the field and scored a goal to win the game, but the extra man was not involved. Would it be a replay?

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    Mute Brian Dunne
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    Jan 25th 2023, 3:59 PM

    It drags on because the gaa didn’t take control and order a replay straight away.

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    Mute Daniel Roche
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    Jan 25th 2023, 4:18 PM

    @Brian Dunne: It’s not as simple as that.

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    Mute Brian Dunne
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    Jan 25th 2023, 4:19 PM

    @Daniel Roche: why not

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    Mute Shaun Gallagher
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    Jan 25th 2023, 4:31 PM

    @Daniel Roche: Correct

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    Mute Paraic Malone
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    Jan 25th 2023, 5:08 PM

    @Brian Dunne: Every time an official makes a mistake you think we should have a replay. Impossible logic

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    BMJF
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    Mute BMJF
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    Jan 25th 2023, 6:02 PM

    @Brian Dunne: or order the result to stand with a fine straight away!! Either way they needed a decisive decision

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    Mute Michael Costello
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    Jan 25th 2023, 5:08 PM

    Errors/mistakes all over the place. But if Crokes can answer this question with their hand on heart and truthfully, option 2 , a reply would be a fair outcome. Question , if the shoe was on the other foot and it was them that was beaten in the same manner , would they lodge an objection.

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    BMJF
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    Mute BMJF
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    Jan 25th 2023, 6:04 PM

    @Michael Costello: GAA should have issued a fine for breach and concluded that result could stand – impact of extra player for such a short time minimal and didn’t impact result could have been decided by GAA and prevented the scheduling nightmare that will follow. Glen players know in their heart and soul that the extra players likely didn’t impact the result

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    Mute Michael Costello
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    Jan 25th 2023, 9:51 PM

    @BMJF: Agree but just thinking out loud..

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    Mute CryptoFactor ☘️
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    Jan 25th 2023, 6:26 PM

    Regardless of how minimal, Paul Finaly with Monaghan vs Meath in 2005 Div 2 final in Croker too of all places. Also, where does one draw the line on how minimal the effect? 16 players? 17 players? 18 is it? How many is too many? We all know anything over is the answer.

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    Mute Barrycelona
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    Jan 25th 2023, 6:29 PM

    This is, not about the clubs involved but about the GAA/CCCC making and strictly implementing the rules. They regularly bottle it because there is a lack of clarity in some of the decisions, like this one. The biggest ‘con’ is the overturning of referees’ decisions and two-week bans instead of two-match bans, if sent off. Replay the match and suspend the ’16th player’ who came onto the pitch or the player he should have replaced.

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    BMJF
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    Mute BMJF
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    Jan 25th 2023, 6:01 PM

    This whole saga has become ridiculous! GAA should have stepped in, acknowledged a rule was broken, accepted officials had some responsibility too for handling subs, assessed the impact the extra man had on the game for the very brief period he was there and concluded that the likelihood of the result being different had he not been there is very small and therefore concluded that the result stand and KMC are fined for the breach!! Then sit back and take the condemnation for a week or two until it all dies down! Decision made move on

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    Mute Virgil
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    Jan 25th 2023, 9:01 PM

    No replay. Glen could have played another 10 mins and not scored a goal. Man up and take your defeat

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    Mute Eoghan Ryan
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    Jan 25th 2023, 10:58 PM

    @Virgil: yes but if it went on another 10 mins, Crokes would have had 26 on the field! If roles were reversed and it was a northern team that had 16 on the field I suspect attitudes to the offenders would be very different.

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    Mute John O Reilly
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    Jan 25th 2023, 11:35 PM

    @Eoghan Ryan: how’s that chip on your shoulder

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    Mute Brendan Daniel Naughton
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    Jan 26th 2023, 12:30 AM

    If I were Crokes, no way would I agree to a replay. They should refuse and just hand over the cup to Glen. If the extra man had occurred in the first minute of the game noand Glen narrowly missed scoring a goal, would there be the same clamour for a replay? They were 2 points behind when the 16 player controversy arose. Crokes were determined that the trauma of last year’s last second defeat by Kilcoo would not recur. Now if it had so happened that Crokes were 2 points behind and scored a winning goal in the few moments they had 16 players on the field, then Glen would have a clear case for seeking a replay as Crokes would have effectively won the match with 16 players. Their case is based on “what might have been”. They should just take their beating.

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    Mute Patrick Breen
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    Jan 26th 2023, 7:43 AM

    @Brendan Daniel Naughton: I’d argue Crokes should just not have cheated, that would have been better for everyone.

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