AS AFTER EVERY World Cup, the IRFU will conduct a review into Ireland’s campaign at this tournament in Japan.
Clearly, the outcome at this World Cup has been a negative one, with Ireland failing to achieve the IRFU’s stated goal of reaching a first-ever semi-final.
The cold, hard truth is that Ireland were miles off reaching that target, with a comprehensive hammering at the hands of the All Blacks in last weekend’s quarter-final ending Joe Schmidt’s hopes of concluding his tenure with another bit of history.
Looking at the campaign overall, Ireland will have big regrets over their shock defeat to hosts Japan in the pool stages, which left them facing the unenviable task of taking on the world’s best team in the quarter-finals.
Japan deserve all the plaudits they have received for their performance against Ireland, amongst others, and we must respect how they earned their 19-12 victory in Shizuoka, but the IRFU review cannot gloss over the failings from Ireland in defeat.
Similarly to the All Blacks game, Ireland’s error count was deeply damaging as basic mistakes ensured a collapse after leading 12-3 early in that fixture.
Even in the 35-0 win over Russia, it appeared clear that this was not a confident and calm Ireland squad, with their error-strewn third quarter among the poorest passages they delivered under Schmidt.
The opening win over Scotland was excellent, to be fair, and Ireland seemed to have steadied themselves with a controlled bonus-point win over Samoa but the whole thing collapsed in the end against the All Blacks.
Beating the Kiwis would have been perhaps the greatest achievement in Schmidt’s time in charge but not to fire a single shot until the game was well over was utterly dispiriting for Ireland.
The IRFU will surely be the first to acknowledge that Schmidt’s time in charge of Ireland has been largely brilliant, with his team creating history and winning a Grand Slam, but this review will focus specifically on the World Cup and why it went so poorly.
Unfortunately for Ireland supporters, these World Cup reviews are not published publicly for all to see. The IRFU treat the findings as sensitive information and instead our understanding of what has been learned will come through a media briefing with performance director David Nucifora, which may take place before the end of 2019.
Post-2015, the union decided that player depth was the most pressing issue to address. That came after Ireland lost five key players before the quarter-final defeat to Argentina, with Schmidt rueing the absence of his main leaders.
As a result, Nucifora began to initiate increased player movement between provinces – Joey Carbery to Munster being one example – while examining how the IRFU identified talent and making moves to begin to work closely with players at younger ages.
For this year’s review, the union will need to be brutally honest after yet another World Cup underperformance from Ireland. Clearly, some change is required.
This review must cover all bases – from how Schmidt and coaching staff prepared the players for the World Cup, how senior players on central contracts failed to deliver on the big occasion, and why less experienced players struggled to break through based on form.
The review into Ireland’s mental approach to this World Cup will be important, with Ireland’s players seemingly struggling to be clear-headed under the pressure of the biggest tournament in the game.
Style of play may be a consideration in the review. Is it time for the IRFU to clearly define how they want Irish rugby teams to play? Do the provinces need to buy into a specific philosophy? Can Irish rugby be innovative and tactically lead the way in the next four-year cycle, or do we simply see a continuation of what came up short at the World Cup?
Andy Farrell is the next man in as head coach, with Mike Catt coming on board as attack coach, John Fogarty joining as scrum coach, and forwards coach Simon Easterby and skills/kicking coach Richie Murphy continuing in their roles.
The Englishmen will be under pressure to get off to a strong start, but should the IRFU ease some of that heat by openly stating that they can accept mixed results at the beginning if the new coaching team is to really shake things up tactically and technically?
Even looking at Schmidt’s set-up, might Ireland have benefited from bringing in a coaching consultant at some point? Is there value in intermittently having an outside voice come in to question and query what has been the status quo? Would Ireland have benefited from shaking things up before the World Cup after a poor 2019 Six Nations?
The IRFU’s media policy may be worth considering in this review, with Schmidt possibly having invested too much negative energy into this area.
One-on-one interviews with players and coaches were abolished in recent years, while some players seemed to be increasingly concerned with ‘slipping up’ in front of the media rather than being open.
Of course, some in the public won’t care whether the media is given accurate injury information or ignored, while others will argue that the rugby media do a poor job.
The supporters, the real lifeblood of the sport, must be considered centrally in all of this. While Ireland have filled the Aviva Stadium regularly, tickets prices have made some fans turn away.
Some of the more casual sports fans in Ireland appear to have taken genuine pleasure at the latest World Cup failing for the rugby team and that’s worth considering too – why is there an active dislike for rugby in some quarters and can anything be done to ease it?
There are so many areas this review can touch on, and the hope is that everyone involved takes a humble approach to it and leaves egos at the door.
Schmidt and his key players should be at the heart of understanding what went wrong, but the IRFU needs to look at itself too.
Is the pressure that appears to come with each Six Nations campaign conducive to improving for a World Cup further down the line? Is the IRFU doing enough to ensure players are coming from areas of Ireland beyond the superb schools system?
What future does the club game in Ireland have and can the IRFU rebuild the bridges that have very much been burned in that department? Many within the All-Ireland League feel like it has been cut adrift.
It may not seem directly relevant to the national team underperforming at this World Cup but every part of Irish rugby contributes to the health of the national team.
There are no simple answers, of course, and this is a multi-layered and complex issue that is affected by factors within the Ireland squad and things at very different levels of the game.
Irish rugby is doing lots of things superbly and many aspects of the system in Ireland are envied by unions elsewhere. Winning a Grand Slam as recently as last year underlines that there has been plenty of good work done.
But yet another poor World Cup campaign shows that there is still major room for improvement and the latest review needs to be brutally honest or the IRFU is wasting everyone’s time.
Just throwing this one out there. Is the no foreign based players part of problem. We have a small pool at best of times. Ruling good players out for reason of location seems daft. I know they have many more players abroad but look at transformation in springboks when they changed rule. Other benefit of some big names going abroad is it frees up money to invest in up and coming talent and gives emerging players more opportunity at provinces because let’s face it there is also a lack of opportunity for younger players there too.
Does the player welfare policy make such a big difference? We seem to get as many injuries as anyone. Do Irish top players play for longer? I’m not sure.
@Kevin McCarthy: Realistically who do you call into the squad from abroad? Zebo looks well out of shape, Ryan at 35 years old is not long term viable, O’Brien wont play a game for London Irish till March at least and again age, and Madigan would not be much of an upgrade compared to Carbery and Carty.
@Kevin McCarthy: is this rule more so to protect the provinces, as it reduces the lure of playing elsewhere if you can’t represent Ireland?
@Kevin McCarthy: Good points. The flip side to that of course is to look how bad we were in the 90s when we had teams full of players plying their trade outside of Ireland. When it comes to extra cash the provinces will always lose out to the big money leagues in England and France, that’s bad for us as rugby fans wanting to see the best players lining up in the pro 14 each week and you could argue it’s bad in general for the development of rugby in the country. Having players make a binary upfront choice (minus Sexton) of having the opportunity of playing for their country and ply their trade at home or to forfeit that opportunity for extra cash and play abroad is one of the main tools the IRFU use to shore up revenue for the provinces and the academys.
@Kevin McCarthy: Foreign based player rule is what makes us not Scotland. If we let our best players leave our provinces won’t be competitive, they won’t earn money to keep academies going, the younger players won’t be playing in the latter rounds of top level competition and might not even be qualifying for them. The truth is we have a limited number of players that have the potential to make it as senior internationals and we can’t afford the mega bucks to bring in top foreign talent so if we can’t keep our top players here with the carrott of international rugby then our teams will simply not be able to compete in European competition and will not be able to sustain their academies.
@Kevin McCarthy: No, that policy is absolutely the correct one. New Zealand and England both have the same policy, and while they may have bigger player pools, the IRFU is dead right in a no overseas player policy. The provinces must be kept competitive, and the IRFU must have control over key players.
@Kevin McCarthy: SA had a change in allowing overseas players be picked as players left South Africa on mass for economic reasons and due to the quota’s that were brought in meaning less change in the first team for young white players. It has worked as they have a huge number of rugby players in SA and as such have a constant conveyor belt of talent coming through to populate their teams.
@Kevin McCarthy: Your argument re money being free up wouldn’t quite work as you see it due to our provinces not being competitive in European and domestic competitions so where would they money come from? Also the players playing abroad would be flogged to bits so this would not help our international prospects, look at the French players playing in the 6 nations.
@Kevin McCarthy: There is no lack of opportunity for young players here with young players playing for all the provinces and plenty of room for more in certain positions. Maybe they might not get into the Leinster team but if they are not good enough maybe they should move to another province and try and get good enough. The model for bringing through younger players is not perfect but it works.
@Martin Kennedy: Well said and far more concise than I could have put it.
@Kevin McCarthy: and week in week out our club teams turn into the welsh, so once every 4 years we get a very marginally better international side for a World Cup with totally uncompetitive 4 provincial sides with a hand full of spectators going to watch a bunch of kids lose each week and every decent player than comes through getting his agent to pack him on the first plane out of the country.
@Kevin McCarthy: No, I would agree completely with the current policy.
Bad and all as we think we are ATM we do have a lot of very good players that French clubs would love to get their hands on: Conor Murray, James Ryan, Tadhg Furlong etc.
Allow players play abroad and all our top players would be made offers they’d find hard to turn down and our provinces would suffer.
However I would change it so that if a player has reached a certain number of caps or been available for Ireland for a certain number of years they can then go abroad and continue playing for Ireland.
That would only be fair.
@Kevin McCarthy: If star players went abroad the sport in this country would wither very quickly, we know how that story ends from looking at the Irish soccer teams.
Ideally there might be some balance there but the consequences are so grave if the floodgates open that I think the IRFU are correct to have a zero tolerance policy.
@Éamann Ó Duinn: zebo is flying at the moment
@Kevin McCarthy: who did we miss out on?? A semi for Zebo?? I can’t think of another
Can’t wait for a six nations full of Conor Murray’s boxkicks and that thrill of excitement you feel when Kearney’s or Earls charging through and you’re wondering if they’ll take the catch or not. Other than that I’m not expecting a whole lot.
@Richard: you add Sexton to that list, time for him to be on and let Younger out half’s fight it out
@Patrick O Connell: Sexton has had a free pass despite is annus horribilis v the Kiwi’s. Those two missed touches were crucial to Ireland trying to get into the game, if it was Carty he would be getting it in the neck from all quarters. Sexton has not been good since he got his world player of the year award and it is doubtful he will ever hit near those heights again.
@Dino: Exactly: due to the sycophantic nature of the typical Irish rugby fan/observer, you’re better off with utterly out of form established players, to prevent in form players getting it in the neck as you say.
Any serious rugby nation would have discarded with a quarter of that panel for the world cup, whereas Ireland (Toner aside) decided to plough ahead.
@Dino: it’s the complete opposite of omahony in regards criticism
@Dino:
He got the award for what he had achieved in that year (and Joe got Coach of the year as well) it all came down to 2018 but it was a build up from the last couple of years.
He played well against Scotland I believe we would have beaten Japan if he was playing IMO The N Z game ALL were bad :: he still the best we have .Carty is a fine Club player (Pro 14 and some HCCup games ) Joey should be playing and starting if we want him to move on or IMO play him fullback with Sexton O/H :: NZ have tried it and it looks good Playmaker at O/H and at F/B and they can interchange during the game, to who is first receiver :: worth a look at (let him play at O/H for Munster he is good enough to move to F/B for the Irish games)
@Martin Quinn: He hasn’t played a decent game since he disgraced himself in Thomond Park !
@Martin Quinn: cant ageee with any of that I’m afraid. He “was” our best player butlike with ROG time waits for no man and he just isn’t doing it on a consistent basis anymore. Sure he has good moments in games but he has plenty of misses too and offers virtually no carrying threat from 10 anymore which makes it easier for teams to defend against us. He’s just minding himself I’m sure but no player is good enough to be going into games playing in fear of getting injured.
And another thing: what’s all this nonsense about Ireland not being able to experiment during the 6 Nations cos it’s the IRFU’s cash cow? Oh so nobody’s going to turn up in Lansdowne Road if Ireland lose a couple of matches? The demand for 6 Nations tickets is huge. There would only be a significant revenue loss if Ireland started losing consistently like they did vs NZ last week – a most unlikely scenario . As long as Ireland give their all, the fans will be there to support them. On top of which, the notion, that going with tried and trusted players, even if they are out of form, is more likely to bring success than giving youth it’s head, died last Saturday in Tokyo. Anyone, who doesn’t acknowledge that fact, has their head in the sand.
@Riocard Ó Tiarnaigh: Prize money 2019 Grand Slam 5.5m, 2nd 3.3m, 3rd 2.3m, 4th 1.8m, 5th 1.3m, 6th 0.8m. A drop from 1st or second to 5th (could easily happen if we lost to Scotland while experimenting) would mean upwards of 2m of a loss in revenue not including sponsorship bonus’s and sponsorship renewal values etc.
Pat Lam in his time with Connacht brought their skill set to a new level to compete with the other provinces. Their passing, handling and offloading were a pleasure to watch. Wrapping up our elite players in cotton wool does not seem to work when we compete at World Cup. Take a look at our near neighbours Wales and go figure where we went wrong.
@Aidan Kearney, Wicklow CCRO.Leinsterrugby: he got 1 year in 5 right, look at his last year, they wouldn’t have beat bective’s second team.
@Aidan Kearney, Wicklow CCRO.Leinsterrugby: Pat Lam’s work was the most impressive coaching job that was ever seen within Irish rugby, the IRFU should have thrown everything to keep him in the system with a view to integrating him into the national setup.
@Chris Mc: He was only there for 4 years and they were hugely competitive in the 2nd, it was only a few late results and a bad injury to Bundee Aki that saw them miss out on the Heineken Cup to Scarlets.
They won the Pro 14 in the 3rd and he was already halfway out the door for the final season.
@Chris Mc: he was not backed at all after they won the pro12 with the spine of the team leaving or forced to leave without adequate replacements (henshaw, muldowney, aj mcginty). He was trying to manage with one hand tied behind his back and then he got the offer from Bristol and said why should he stay in Connacht to be shafted by the IRFU? No way this situation would have been allowed to happen in any other province by the IRFU
It always amazes me when the “hindsight brigade” come out in force.
@Eoin McCarthy: It is the foresight of the hindsight brigade that impresses me
Nucifora hasn’t taken this much of a beating since he played in Musgrave Park in 92. That aside I think he’s doing a great job, Ireland’s structure is fine, they just need a coach capable of making the hard calls.
@Jim Demps:
That post will keep the dogs off Nucifora, his lordship has deemed it so !!
Musgrave Park in 92, always bring in your bias !!
Definition of Hard calls ::more from the south ::
@Martin Quinn: indecipherable
@Martin Quinn: Tell us again about the English coming over when no other country would……
@Jim Demps: what has Nucifora achieved out of interest Jim? Two world cups under his high performance programme and what have we to show?
Only lads capable of going to next two world cups are JR, Carbery, Larmour, Ringrose and Stockdale…..
@TheHospitalPass: furlong? Leavy? And a host of promising youngsters
@Tim Magner: Furlong would be 34 in two world cups time.
I think we all saw how well we fared with a 37 year old captain ffs
@TheHospitalPass: yeah but 2 world cups is a bit daft, there’s probably lads still in school for the one in 8 years
@Tim Magner: probably? Most definitely I’d say, might even be one or two who haven’t even picked rugby as their main sport yet, larmour was playing international hockey for Ireland 4 years ago I think I read somewhere.
@Dino Baggio: I know, he was the first lad I’d seen commenting on the 2027 WC and planning for it! We might all be dead then…
Nucifora should be fired for moving Carbery to Munster, while he was still under contract to Leinster, for all the bad blood it caused – see the Thomond match at Xmas. Richie Murphy should also be replaced, as the skills the Irish team collectively and individually displayed in Japan were completely substandard. Finally Philip Browne should be given heave-ho too, then as IRFU CEO he is ultimately responsible for this latest fiasco at the RWC. The IRFU need to face up to the fact, that Ireland are a laughing stock, the chokers of world rugby, who’ve never won a single knock-out match at the world cup since its inception in 1987 – and do something about it. Still fuming!!!!!!!
@Riocard Ó Tiarnaigh: No we should actually just release Carbery for agreeing to move at all, he did have the final say so he must be held accountable!!
@Riocard Ó Tiarnaigh: the whole Carbury thing only happened because the IRFU made a mess of the paddy Jackson cockup. Carbury was flying at 15 for Leinster and will end up at 15 for munster, TB will start and joey will be moved.
@Chris Mc: I think it’s gas that you never give any credit to any of the ex Leinster players who’ve moved on. Earlier it was Beirne and how he’s not a good second row and now it’s Carbery. Carbery is clearly a ten and will be the next starting Irish ten as much as you don’t like it. He hasn’t played a single minute at 15 with Munster and he won’t either given we’ve the most complete 15 in the country already in the club in Haley. Strong chance it’ll be Haley and Larmour scrapping it out or the FB jersey come early next year.
@Riocard Ó Tiarnaigh:
“Still fuming!!!!!!!”
Oh we are so sorry for you ::you put so much into our games all that sitting on your coach and eating poor Pizza and warm beer:: And all you asked for was to beat the number one team in the world (don’t bring in we were no. 1 we all know where we stood) But what did the team do they let you down :: They just played badly against N Z and after all your effort no wonder you are down ::Well after we get rid of all those people you want gone , there will be a lot of space for progressive posters like yourself to get stuck in and turn our game around ::
You take care and keep your chin up you will get us out of being the laughing stock, the chokers of world rugby to greater things ::
ps
if you are still fuming take a pill ::good man
@Martin Quinn:
“Haley and Larmour scrapping it out or the FB jersey yes it has a funny sound to it Ha Ha Ha :: Haley will play for Munster and that is it ::Conway is a better F/B then him :: but that is up to your coach (unless you have taken over : ) he is only a good club Player for Munster :: be happy with that ::
You have the best young F/B in Ireland playing in the wrong position :: But let’s hope your season goes well with your new coaches :: we need all 4 provinces do well ::
@Martin Quinn: you haven’t a clue
@Martin Quinn: Thrilled my passionate interest in the fortunes of the Irish rugby team afforded you the opportunity to broadcast your oh so wry and witty cynicism to the world. Hope it made your day.
@Jim Demps: now now Jim don’t be telling lies. I never said beirne wasn’t a good second row, I said he’s not the best we have. Plenty of players have moved on from Leinster and bettered themselves, your man beirne for example, Quinn roux, Cooney etc
As for joey we’ll see what position he ends up, 15 is not too good for Barrett but beneath joey?
@Jim Demps: Haley… the most complete fullback in the country? Really? We’re in worst trouble than I thought so
@Jim Demps: beat Potential fullback in the country was / is Carbery… Kearney may not have even gone to the world cup if Carbery had stayed a Leinster and Jackson was still playing
@Jim Demps: Mute him Jim. I have and it’s great not seeing the crap he writes anymore
@Martin Quinn: absolutely, carberry played his best games for Leinster at 15. Seems to be forgotten about on the whole. He’s gone on record saying he prefers 10 but that doesn’t mean he’s better at 15. At 15 he has more space to attack which I think benefits him.
@Martin Kennedy: yea but leinster wouldn’t play him at 10. He’s after a very injury interrupted year yet just before and after Xmas he looked the real deal for Munster at outhalf. Rather than give the lad a run of games to see how he’s going to get on, the whole leinster fan base narrative now is that he was never a good 10, even though if you were to look back at the comments after he left, Chris mc was out front & centre bemoaning the fact that Byrne was too robotic, played too far behind the gainline. Give the lad a chance, he looked really sharp in the 1st world cup warm up, he’s attacking kicking was something we haven’t seen from Ireland in a while, he put through a beaut of a grubber v nz that henshaw butchered
Ireland looks better than what they are because most of their key players only play in the Heineken cup and in International games. They have an advantage in terms of fitness and tactical preparation as a result. Comes the World Cup, all other teams catch up since they spend 2-3 months in camps together. So it’s not too much about Ireland being bad every 4 years, it’s about all teams having the same opportunity to be prepared and then the real intrinsic value of teams makes the difference.
@ForrestG45: completely agree. Player welfare is only an advantage for us between world cups. English players were flogged straight after the lions tour. Irish players were rested and fresh. NZ we’re wrecked when they played us in 2018 also.
If you look at the Irish team that started against England in the grand slam victory it’s exactly the same team that started vs NZ with the exception of Leavy. Even the bench was similar with larmour, porter etc. If you look at the English team, 7 of those starters didn’t even make their WC squad, Hartley, Haskell, Wigglesworth, Teo, Joseph, robshaw etc.
Despite working towards having lots of depth no actual changes were made to freshen things up. Anybody have any thoughts on this?
@Stephen Duke: nope you’ve pretty much covered it all there tbf
@Stephen Duke: It used to be said that it was harder to get OFF the Irish team than to get on it (How old was Tony O’Reilly when he was called back in tpplay against England in 197x? Can’t remember the exact year, early 70s). We seem to have reverted to that position again – despite the efforts to increase the depth of playing squad.
It wasn’t the defeat , no disgrace in losing . If you play your best and get beaten by a better team, that’s life
Every facility was extended to our golden boys and their coach .
He repaid us by coaching a one dimensional boring game plan . The team repaid us by playing like frightened rabbits .
Don’t think we’ll properly realise how much we have really underachieved until/if we actually get to a Semi final. Already depressing knowing that England will play in their 5th Semi tomorrow, Wales their 3rd
Demps in Farrell out
@T Dawg: you make a good case. You have my support
@Jim Demps: Great, your support on this is a nice first step. Step 2, home games moved to Thomond!
@Jim demps: you could be an assistant coach
@Thomas Lyster: I think I was pretty clear above. Jim is head coach or nothing!
@T Dawg: Demps4Prez!
@Shougeki: Jim for headman
@Thomas Lyster: Go Go Jim Go Go
Just Go Go Go
@T Dawg: musgrave park
@T Dawg: and you’d have 23 players form Munster :-)
They need to make it very clear that going to the World Cup is Not a holiday or a Retirement party.
Given that the South of France beckons in 4 years and the new Coach had a contract to the end of it and a certain player probably sees himself as indespensible, I won’t hold my breath.
There needs to be an alignment of styles with all provinces away from Joe’s reactive style. There seems to be an autonomy to hire coaches, but a subservience when it comes to playing players. One thing that stands out is the public opinion that Joe maybe didn’t trust the players to play with flair, I would be very annoyed if that were the case. Picking players on reputation was a big bug bear of mine, it has to create some kind of private divide amongst the players who maybe felt they deserved to be picked. Picking Klein for his ability to play tighthead lock was farcical, maybe not Sam Burgess level; but still a sign of the negative “reactive” approach. There’s so many opinions being circulated by the media and ex players, but one thing is for certain, all the opinions can’t be wrong.
@Dan Finlay: tbf if players skill levels are high enough they can play any game plan. They don’t all play the same tactical style for their clubs in NZ. The national manager can’t have a massive impact on players skill levels as he doesnt have then day to day but he can pick the players with the most skill instead of just going for the best athletes or the players that are competing at the highest level.
@Dino Baggio: I’d argue Aki is connachts best player yet when he plays for Ireland he seems to lack the ability to pass & get a backline moving. Good player though, tackles, carries but as a first centre lacks the ball playing skills
@Tim Magner: great play maker for Connacht but its a different game plan with different lines of support from the Connacht players. Connacht like to keep the ball alive more and Bundee is great at looking for offloads and supporting the ball carrier. He is the big fish at Connacht and everyone follows his lead whereas with Ireland he is just a cog in a machine so his influence is less.
Anyone who thinks there will be much change needs their head examined, especially considering Andy Farrell is more inclined to be even more attritional and boring than Schmidt. Be great to see sexton Murray, O’Mahoney, stander , Kearney, Healy, Cronin all retire from international rugby.. another screw up by irfu appointing Farrell, should have been Lancaster. The writing was on the wall even when we were winning the GrandSlam in 2018.
@Bill Clay: nobody has seen Farrell as a head coach so we don’t know what he’s going to do. Ask the English about Lancaster as a head coach though
We do seem to be getting this WC cycle thing all wrong.
The best thing they can do right now is keep it simple.
Concentrate on developing quality players and drastically improving skill-sets for the next couple of years and then lets start worrying about the next WC.
Joe is the best. Ireland should be eternally grateful. We all need to wake up and snort the covfefe
It seems we just need to not rely on players who have not been performing and resting on their laurels. The prime example being Peter O’Mahony, 2 tackles v Wales and a terrible 6 nations overall, “but he is so good in the line-out” is a ridiculous statement as anybgame he has played against tough competition we did not see it. Was superb last year and cannot doubt his talent and ability. But form is temporary and his is not there at the moment and the permanent class was not up to the mark.
@Cranesofdublin: pom while not brilliant, wasnt our worst player at the WC by a long shot. Bringing henshaw was the disaster, he was absolutely brutal
Find it hard to understand how the irish provinces can continually outperform the welsh clubs in pro 14 and heineken cup yet the welsh national team can be more succesful thsn ireland at internationsl level.
@tom whelan: because non of those players get picked, comparatively too the old guard. Marmion to Saracens says it all.
@Mike McGann:
Marmion could be the big loss of this World Cup…
There was only three changes in the first fifteen be tween the two all blacks game over 11 months…
Bundee was enforced. Marmion was a mistake and am sorry there is a feeling if he played in different province colour he might have got more respect. Toner was a call but Kleyn is not a better player..
All this happened while some established players were loosing form at both international and provincial level.
The canary in the mine was killed during 6nations but the Saracans game was the real wake up call…
instead of reacting looking for options, they doubled down on there established players.
Connacht gave Russia as good a beating in Moscow as Ireland gave in RWC.
It seems that the defensive showing by Ireland against the All Blacks has gone unnoticed. While Mike Catt maybe helpful for the attack who exactly is going to shore up the defense?
Rassie has shown why a very big pool of players is needed to produce enough World Class players to compete. In the finals it will come down to the teams with the biggest Pools of players. So has the IRFU done enough to develop players from non traditional schools backgrounds?
Given that Ireland will never have the physical size to absorb the attrition rate of England, France or the Springboks and the fact that Ireland struggled with the same style of play from the opposition in both Quarter Finals is it time to look at adopting that style?
@Christiaan Theron: they are doing lots of work but it takes a long time to progress at pro level
Leinster with their new facilities in donnybrook and those planned for rest of province will help do that. Connacht doing very well wih development with kids simply playing club school rugby and new clubs and schools playing year on year
Munster had clubs under 16/18.5 cups that have expanded every year getting clubs to play more games including more games against the best sides across the province not simply those in region they’re from. This year has a clubs squad competing in he schools cup group stage which is ongoing. This will help as well.
@Ormond: still private school game in leinster and ulster – schools also have elite facilities and coaching – basically academies for the provinces
@Dave Byrane: Is there much progress in the clubs at Leinster and Ulster?
@Christiaan Theron: the defence was under pressure due to the attack malfunctioning terribly. So many handling errors and missed touches etc letting the ABS have broken play counters or free field position. The only way Ireland could have got close to the ABS was if they held the ball for 80% of the game but or attack couldn’t manage that.
@Dino Baggio: The Irish attack was under pressure from the AB defence. However, Ireland used to pride themselves on the number of tackles they could make to win a game. Ireland scored 17 points to AB 44. This tells its own story. Even with a half decent attack, how many teams can let in that many points and still win?
@Christiaan Theron: Most of Irelands errors were unforced, Sexton pass to Kearney that was too late had nothing to do with a desperate past ditch man and ball tackle from ghe defence it was jyst Sexton being too slow releasing the ball. The two missed touches had nothing to do with nz defence, dropped passes in midfield with no tackler near them nothing to do with nz defence, even the balls lost in contact were just lazy technique by Ireland nothing exceptional from nz. You’ve seen today how average nz are, I called ut after Ireland game that Eng would hammer them.
The Irish teams game plan was too structured and Conservative. Joe had a plan A but no plan B when the pressure came on. Also the provinces should be linked in to National teams way of playing, no point having Leinster playing one way the National team playing the opposite
@Mark Boyle: cant have the provinces playing all the same way, you play a system that suits your environment and the players at your disposal. What we should have are players that can catch and pass a ball under pressure and spot where the space is on a pitch and how to manipulate defences to create space. These are basic skills that all players should have and then the national manager can play any game plan he wants