MAY ANNOUNCEMENTS WILL always be precariously balanced in between historical landmarks.
And yet yesterday’s long list of departures from Connacht could only seem stark in contrast to the celebratory mood 24 hours earlier as their social media channels were flooded with memories on the four-year anniversary of their Pro12 title victory over Leinster.
Three men among the dozen departees started the unforgettable 20-10 win. Niyi Adeolokun scored a thrilling try. Eoin McKeon and Tom McCartney were fierce in contact as the men of the west created the sweetest imaginable finale to a season.
McCartney takes his leave from the game at 34 after making a massive impact in Galway and might feel hard done by to miss out on a Test cap through his remarkable consistency backed by a phenomenal engine.
Connacht must have been loathe to part ways with a native westerner such as McKeon, a battling veteran of 137 matches for his home province over a decade of service.
Adeolokun stands out as a shock among the list of 12. His rise was a hallmark of the Pat Lam era having been plucked from Tony Smeeth’s Trinity setup to ultimately earn an Ireland cap a little over two years after turning pro.
Grassroots to green shirts indeed.
The Dubliner was a dazzling element in a thrilling Connacht attack and the Sportsground intuitively rose to their feet whenever the wing was given any patch of open ground to exploit. Unfortunately, his final outings could not do justice to his existing highlight reel.
At 29, he would surely have an array of options in any ordinary off-season, but that will come as cold comfort to Connacht supporters as more of their title winning side move on to another challenge. Not that they’re not used to it. In some ways it’s the story of that side.
Robbie Henshaw and AJ MacGinty were already bowing out when they helped bring silverware west of the Shannon and, of the 15 who started in Murrayfield on 28 May 2016, news from 29 May 2020 whittles the remaining number down to six.
Finlay Bealham and Ultan Dillane are all that remain of the pack. Tiernan O’Halloran, Matt Healy, Bundee Aki and Kieran Marmion from the backline – and the exit has called to a few of those men too.
Yet while they are in Connacht, they are potent weapons to have whenever rugby returns in whatever guise it can take. Last week’s announcement of new signings still signals Galway as a place to excite and energise talent that has slipped through the cracks in better-resourced provinces.
Every sporting body is facing reams of challenges in the aftermath of the pandemic with gate receipts not existing in the foreseeable future and a recession potentially leaving all revenue thin on the ground.
Connacht have always had to cut their cloth accordingly, but they will hope the hard work put into their academy and structures will be robust enough to lean on.
Perhaps we’ll even see the knock-on value of 2016′s impossible dream, a generation inspired by it.
The high quality leinster lads don’t seem keen on a move to connacht and that’s fair enough. But connacht badly need an 8 and it’ll be interesting over the next yr or so, in the big matches one or two of Doris, deegan and conan won’t make the 23. They are all thereabouts for ireland and if the irfu doesn’t support connacht financially we’ll have Irish squads with lads that don’t play hcup rugby
@Tim Magner: who is your starting 8 for Leinster? Doris for me. Deegan could easily play 6. Tough on Conan.
@Kevin: I dunno. I think Doris is the best 8 by a mile. But I think conan has been exceptional for leinster, the game plan there suits him so much better than the Irish one. Remember a Yr or so ago an awful lot of people wanted him over cj. Deegan is a superb athlete but might find himself in a super sub role, will he be happy with that?
@Tim Magner: Doris is actually from Connacht so it would make sense for him to want to move home
@Gareth Ward: yea but he’ll probably be the starting 8 for the potential hcup champions. That’s the problem, I’m sure all 3 boys back themselves to start for leinster. The only way I can see them move to connacht is for serious money, probably all black test player money. That ain’t around
@Tim Magner: could see Deegan facilitated at 6 and Doris at 8 with Conan the odd man out. Conan has been superb and it would be tough on him. He got injured at the wrong time. He was first choice for Leinster and pushing CJ for an Irish place. I simply can’t see one of them going to Connacht next season. They’ll each back themselves when we get back. If one of them is missing big games then it may force a rethink.
@Kevin: I can maybe see deegan at 6 with leavy at 7. He’s a funny one, a gifted athlete but offers nothing at the breakdown, doesn’t seem to be a grafter. He’s a very quick and skillful ball carrier so he’ll have a highlight reel but you’d need to balance the back row. I think ideally leinster would love 6 ruddock 7 leavy 8 doris. If conan doesn’t start does he make a 23? Deegan would be on the bench. Or baird. No spot for jvdf either, penny nowhere near. That’s leinsters big problem with everyone fit. For the fans any of them leaving is a big problem but if you’re ambitious? Would they join connacht, being harsh i doubt it
@Tim Magner: my ideal back row is Ruddock, Doris and Leavy with Deegan in the bench. I pick Leavy over JVDF all day. What to do with Penny is the question. He needs games. A stint out west might not be a bad thing. Great posit for Leo to be in but it will be hard keep everyone happy.
@Kevin: Kevin I’m not going to go munster v leinster with you but a year ago conan displacing cj was what supposedly ireland needed. Hugh Farrelly reckoned on extra. Ie that ireland would win the wc with him at 8, tís a fair fall after 6 months out injured. I know Doris looks a major talent but in fairness we haven’t seen him up against anyone really good yet. Leinster are going to have a big problem keeping br players happy playing just pro14. It’s a great sign of the system but I think ye should brace yers elves for more good players leaving and poor ger Gilroy calling out to axe the academy
@Kevin: Stints aren’t the way to build teams or how provinces should be treated. It should be obvious but needs to frequently be repeated that Connacht aren’t a feeder team for Leinster.
@Tim Magner: if Conan had stayed fit maybe the WC might have been different? There’s a serious out of sight out of mind with Conan. The leavy jvdf thing has nearly always seen one of them injured while the other plays. Penny is still very young. Deagan needs to add a little grunt more physical games, I just can’t see him start ahead of ruddock or fardy at 6 away in france for example. Doris looks the real deal too.
For The connacht situation maybe a one year loan deal for game time would work for one or 2 of them but as you say make the leinster side and you pushing for HC and league titles and young confident players who believe they can won’t want to move.
@Rochelle: leinster signed 1 player from connacht how on earth would that make them a feeder club. The vast vast majority of the 50 strong squad at leinster came from leinsters own academy. Leinster is leinsters feeder club.
@Tim Magner: To say Deegan ‘offers nothing at the breakdown’ is completely wrong. He’s not a heavy ruck presence, but he’s a constant turnover threat.
I seem to remember him bagging a big turnover in the RDS against a certain side in red a few years back for example…
@Tim Magner: agree with you on the number 8 for Connacht. We really need a big ball carrier we have been missing that. I can’t get the logic of leinster players not wanting to move a little over 2 hrs from Dublin. They all can’t play 8 for leinster on a given day. Time irfu moved them to get game time. Surely ambitious players will want to play 80mins consistently.
@Hogan Dental & Medical Services:
Pro rugby players are by nature mostly confident in their own abilities and ambitious. If you look at Doris/Deegan/Conan each of them have test abilities and have been born and raised in Leinster’s environment, which is one of the best in Europe.
So it may be actually be more ambitious to stay in Leinster and back yourself than move to Connacht where it’s likely you may never win anything and may not be playing in Europe.
The IRFU can’t just ‘move’ players. It doesn’t work like that.
@Oval Digest: Deegan won 3 turnovers in about 20 games this season and another solitary turnover at the lineout. 3+1 would be an average day out for most backrowers. Safe enough to say that no, he isn’t much of a turnover threat. Coupled with a low tackle success rate, the lowest I think of all the backrowers in the Irish squad and you’d think he has a bit of work to do. Lovely player with the ball in hand in the wider channels though. Another year or two of decent game time and plenty of work on his weaknesses and he’ll be a fine no.8.
@Oval Digest: ah yea that’s fair enough. I don’t think the breakdown is one of deegan strengths but he’s a cracking player. I just think Doris is the more rounded 8 and ruddock at 6 gives leinster a tough physical edge. If leavy is back to his best it gives leinster way more options
@Hogan Dental & Medical Services: how long do you think leinster will continue to invest in their academy it the IRFU keep moving good young players. Surely they’d just buy in players rather than waste time and effort in forward planning for the best young players to be moved before leinster get any benifit from the years of development they put into that player.
Players like jordie Murphy, Quinn rouox, Jack mcgrath etc moved on because they wanted to.
The other 3 sides have a fair amount of players who came through the leinster academy why risk leinsters commitment to the academy for a very short term gain.
@Jim Demps:
The game he’s currently asked to play with Leinster *is* carrying wide.
He has had guys like VDF/Ruddock in the row with him to do the grunt work.
That doesn’t mean he can’t do it.
It’s the same as POM for example. His stats look awful at times but the reality is sometimes very different.
@Tim Magner: CJ to 6 and Conan at 8 was my wish for Ireland last year. I’m not sure replacing CJ was the right thing to do.
@Chris Mc: some Leinster fans and parts of the media’s suggestion that Leinster should just close the academy because they are losing a few 3rd, 4th and 5th choice lads is my favourite hot take of all. There are genuinely people out there who’d prefer to see young lads not play at all and rot away than make a go of it in another Irish club.
@Jim Demps: What data are you using to measure ‘low tackle success rate’ btw? Would love to see that.
@Oval Digest: not criticising his wide work at all, think it suits him, just contesting your statement that he is a turnover threat. 1 turnover every 5 or 6 games would suggest otherwise wouldn’t it?
@Oval Digest: POM under pressure and three fresh faces – Ireland’s back row for the Six Nations https://the42.ie/4976724
Was from a murray kinsella article this year. Deegan had the lowest tackle success rate of all the back rowers in the squad.
@Jim Demps: Well it might, or looking at bare stats in that way might be too simplistic a measure? Deegan’s role with Leinster isn’t to hit rucks or win turnovers since he has players around him to do that. Doris for eg is a big threat there too.
That doesn’t mean he’s bad it. In fact he has had two last minute game winning turnovers against Irish provinces in the last few years (Connacht & Munster).
‘Turnover threat’ might be pushing it a bit alright, but I don’t think the initial analysis that he ‘offers nothing at the breakdown’ is right. The truth lies somewhere in the middle as with most of these conversations.
@Jim Demps: My point is why forward plan 3 or 4 years in advance and put the effort into these players if they are just moved on by the IRFU when one of the other sides have a gap? You say these players are 3rd 4th 5th choice but the reality is they are part of the planning process. In 2 or 3 seasons they are been primed to be first choice.
@Jim Demps: Hmm… so 87.3% (ie .4% lower than POM) eh?!
I’m not sure that’s a great basis for making decision on.
He also must’ve worked on it because it’s now at 92% – https://www.rugbypass.com/six-nations/teams/ireland/players/max-deegan/
@Jim Demps: you talk about young players not playing and rot away but the reality is the reason these young players are in demand is becuase they are getting game time at leinster. I know you won’t agree on here by you know well that leinster have given game time to academy players because they wanted to not because they have to. Harry Byrne for example is 4th choice outhalf and still in the academy but has had a real decent amount of game time and not because leinster were stuck but becuase they wanted to play him.
@Chris Mc: could you see aungier or solonoa being first choice for leinster in 2/3 years? Do you think either of them have the potential to start the big games ahead of a 29yo furlong or a 26yo porter? There’ll also be a 22yo Clarkson looking for decent gametime. Surely from a national team point of view its better for lads in a key position like th playing regular heineken cup rugby rather than being squad filler in a leinster squad? I realise Leo as head coach would much rather have 5/6 players in all positions but I think the irfu don’t see that as being in their interests and in the end they pay the wages
@Chris Mc: nobody is moved on by the IRFU, the player has to agree to it. If all these players were happy at Leinster they wouldn’t be moving.
@Chris Mc: think any decent planning will accept that there’s variables and unforeseens. It’d be incredibly naive of Leinster if they thought they’d be able to hold onto people for that length of time, it’s not like they were planning with Roman Salanoa in mind 2-3 years ago. It’s not like Leinster haven’t benefitted from players from other provinces
@Oval Digest: didn’t mention anything about making decisions, just simply those were the facts as presented in the article. Stats in isolation can be misleading but for Deegan his defensive stats as a whole are a bit underwhelming. Sure he might be capable of more turnovers or whatever but he hasn’t delivered on it so I think it’s fair enough to conclude that that’s an area of his game where he’s weak.
@Jim Demps: While Deegans young and still improving, he’s been outstanding this year. Against Connacht he made 26 tackles and missed none, also scored 2 trys and had 3 assists, 4 clean breaks with 71 meters of 21 carries. Outside Leinster, Stander is the only player who could come close to putting in a performance like that.
@Jim Demps: Well again, you can conclude that, or you can look at 92% tackle success rate and his propensity for big turnovers and conclude something very different.
I suppose it depends on what lens you put on things eh Jim?
I mean you could look at CJ’s metres made or JVDF’s carries # or POM’s tackle count and conclude the same about those guys, but if you actually look at the game you’d see something different.
Wayne Smith has one of the best takes on stats I’ve ever seen. I think it’s apt in this scenario:
“People point to the number of missed tackles by one team or the percentage of territory of the other, but the surface numbers are utterly meaningless. They tell coaches next to nothing about the game. The stats are often numerical fiction.
The tackle area is a good example of why stats do lie, of why they are completely misleading without the detail. Commentators look at the ratio of missed tackles. But one player can make 100% of his tackles in a match and it tells you nothing about their effectiveness.”
https://www.therugbysite.com/blog/news-opinions/the-stats-do-lie-by-wayne-smith
@Umpaloompa: Yes, it is sort of funny that people are using stats to claim one thing about Deegan, when his overall stats are enormous, and one of the other criticisms about him are that because plays wider these can be inflated.
He’s a serious baller who needs to improve the tighter side of his game, but at Leinster the moment he has guys beside him who can do that.
@Umpaloompa: yup, think he’s a lovely player who’ll only improve the more top class games he gets. Was just pointing out to the other lad that he’s not quite the turnover threat he thought he was
@Oval Digest: which one of the three turnovers this year was the big one?
Stats in isolation aren’t to be trusted, fully agree with you there and never claimed otherwise.
@Jim Demps: Yeah wouldn’t call him a big turnover threat myself. Seems to be a Leinster thing that the default is to get in the line quickly rather than go for a jackle unless guaranteed to win it. That way they keep the defensive line numbers and trust the system. VDF and Porter maybe the exception who commit more than the others
@Tim Magner: the same could be said last season that Byrne would get big game time ahead of Jack mcgrath but simply on form he did. Furlong and Porter both will be evolved with Ireland squads so the next 2 tighthead are not just fillers but players very important to leinster. One injury or a drop in form and that player might play in big HC games of league knockout games.
Porter when he was breaking through had Mike Ross, marty Moore, bent and Furlong ahead of him. He’s now pushing to be first choice.
@Jim Demps: of course they were, why else did they bring him over from the States put the effort into him and give him game time before the Covid break if they were not planning to use him.
@Chris Mc: I thought the next 2 tight heads might have been bent and abeladze? That’s grand saying furlong and porter will be away with Ireland but they’ll be there for all the hcup games and pro14 knockout games. I don’t know how the irfu suggest to players to move but I’m pretty sure no-one asked porter to go. He had a clear pathway with Ross being close to retirement, bent at a certain, albeit decent level & Moore actually leaving. He also didn’t have a potentially better th coming up directly behind him. Seriously do you think having furlong, porter, bent, abeladze, aungier, solonoa and Clarkson, all in the one position, all Irish qualified and all at one province, in a system where the national team only picks players from 4 teams?
@Tim Magner: Think Aungier would have been pushing the 2 lads over the next couple of years. Shows his ambition that he wants more game time which he’ll get and think we’ll be seeing him in an Irish shirt in the future.
Solonoa I thought had loads of potential but still needs a bit of work. Think the more he plays the better he’ll get.
It’s a problem in Leinster to keep them all happy. Leavy, VDF and Connors are probably the best three 7s in the country with Penny the potential to be the best as well. I’d hate to see any of them leave but keeping them happy is going to be a hard task and that’s just one position…
@Umpaloompa: it’s a problem leinster have but it’s hardly a bad one. I can see further down the line one of the 3 out halves munster have coming through may have to leave to get top class game time. Even if Flannery concentrates on full back we’ll still have carbery, jj, Healy and Crowley. Munster have 3 2nd rows in the academy with wycherley, kleyn and beirne still relatively young men. Ulster seem to have a host of young backs coming through. The problem is the irfu need to fund connacht more equally to make it a team that young lads want to join and have a crack at winning things. Connacht didn’t seem to get a lot of support after 15 to keep them at the top table. Unfortunately there’ll be f all money floating around now
Kieran Keane was a disaster as head coach, a terrible appointment from day one. The turnover in playing personnel since the 2016 final is fairly significant.
I’ve not been too impressed with Andy Friend so far either. Talks a great game but doesn’t coach one. Crazy decision to jettison Adeolokun but most of the rest can’t have any complaints after being shown the door.
@Robb Stark: Adeolokun has been injury plagued since the win and hadn’t showed great form when he played. But it’s an area Connacht aren’t strong in. They must surely have more players coming in.
@Kevin: I certainly hope so. And I hope it’s real quality too, not cast offs from Leinster or Munster.
@Robb Stark: agreed. They don’t need cast offs.
@Robb Stark: in hindsight Keane might seem a poor appointment but how could you say that from day one? He came as a highly decorated, highly successful coach from super rugby. I thought it was a great appointment at the the time but I think his personality meant if you didn’t have success people would turn against you, he was a bit miserable
@Kevin: it’s fine if players come to Connacht with fire in their belly and hunger. What’s happened in recent years, though, is that fellas have arrived on to the Sportsgrounds (after being dumped from Leinster/Connacht) with an inflated opinion of their own ability, view joining as a step down and are happy to pick up the wages without really delivering on the field of play.
@Tim Magner: he had no manner. Was pig ignorant to staff, players and supporters alike.
Totally the wrong fit after Patrick Lam.
@Robb Stark: I didn’t hear anything about his manner before he joined. Did you? He seemed to arrive with a pretty good cv
@Tim Magner: spoke to one of the players who told me there was huge communication issues with Keane. He never connected with the players, other coaching staff or the fan base. To quote @robb stark he was pig ignorant.
@Kevin: Aungier is no cast off. A future Irish TH.
Hopefully I’m wrong but as a die hard I feel like we’ve been decimated, I don’t think that the other provinces will be cut like ours especially considering the smaller squad we have in the first place
@Mr Kenobi: until we know how many and particularly who is coming in it’s impossible to judge the decision to let these guys go. As senior player they will all have been on decent wages, but all that step going have been injured more than not over last three seasons, which makes them doubly expensive…
Problem is if we are restocking with talented but underutilised guys from other provinces, will their bodies hold up with increased games played….
De Buitlear for the back 3, Murray at lock, and Dylan Tierney at hooker are expected to be upgraded from the Academy to full contracts. That still leaves two at full back/wing with Lucas from Australia, Adam Byrne or Alex Wootton all options. Wonder might Rob Kearney fancy one more season? Would also expect a 10 to arrive – maybe Byrne the Younger or Hawkshaw from Leinster, a loose head prop, and two more back-rows – one of whom needs to be a ball-carrying No 8. Expect that to be an NIQ with one of Penny or Connors also a possibility.
As long as
A lot of people think that connacht had a small squad last year,they has 50 senior player and 12 academy lads who some of played a good bit,it was an awful year for injuries! ! Colby was the only major loss. Adi I wouldn’t call a huge loss, he has more tape on him than touches of a ball during some matchs! Great player but injuries havnt helped! Saying that, I hope Andy Friend has a few truck up his sleeve! They need some established players coming in and one or two of them need to be enforcers with a real edge!
@mikeyblighe:
This season connacht had 41 + 17 Academy = 58
Munster 43 + 19 = 62
Leinster 46 + 20 = 66
Ulster 44 + 16 = 60
They had the lowest by a fair margin and there’s 8 players of a difference between them and Leinster.
@mikeyblighe: they have signed 4 players so far who will be involved in the first 23, it’s not great from a numbers point of view but there’s good quality and and at great age for building a team.
A ball carrier at 8 is needed but there’s not too many about. Not sure Doris will want to move and the other 2 at leinster are ball players more than carriers.
@mikeyblighe: not sure the size of the squad is the problem. Pat Lamb was successful with similar numbers. Quality Coaching is the real gem for any club. Leinster were lucky with Cheka and Schmidt, unlucky with O’Connor and have landed on their feet with the Cullen / Lancaster combo. Yes there are a raft of talented players at Leinster but that can be said of any of the provinces. Ulster building a squad to be a genuine threat. TBH I think Munsters lack of success (zilch in 8 or 9 years) is more to do with poor coaching and constant changes in coaching than number of players.
I know this will be treated with derision by some commentators here but Munster have the players and have had them for a few years. What they are missing is a clever, world class coach who will stay the distance.
As long as people in Connacht rugby put their best in they’ll be sound
Isn’t it amazing how the armchair experts on here turned this into a Leinster story